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Postby spool on 22 Aug 2017 16:10

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

Hey Pod, did you vote for Trump? (I need yes or no answer, please)
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Postby TechJunkie on 22 Aug 2017 17:16

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

He's going to say that he voted Libertarian, but he parrots the nonsense that Trump says, as if he's hoping to get a job as Spicer's replacement or something. The latest is, 'where will it stop, will people want to tear down the Washington Monument next?'

pod wrote:I'm no fan of slavery and I feel that every individual human is *born* equal. From there on out, it's up to you.


This is the naive idea behind so much of the culture war happening today. Privileged whites have trouble understanding that most blacks have different experiences and that they don't have the same opportunities.

There are way too many white people in my social media feeds talking about how blacks should shut up about slavery and the Jim Crow era and focus on becoming successful people instead, since racism is over.

They just can't understand that the whole point of all of it is that black people generally don't have the same opportunities to become successful people, because racism never ended, and because we're barely past the Jim Crow era. They want to say that we're past Jim Crow, while fighting for the preservation of vestiges of Jim Crow, like those Confederate monuments.

You can't argue for perpetuating the Jim Crow era by saying that it's over. The reason that people want to see those monuments go is that it's not over. And those monuments are a reminder that it's not over.
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Postby JMT on 22 Aug 2017 17:47

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

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Postby TechJunkie on 22 Aug 2017 17:56

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

JMT, are you going to tell us that there were a lot of good people in that crowd carrying tiki torches? And that the protesters were really to blame for the domestic terrorist attack?

I'm guessing that you're one of the people spreading memes on social media right now that blame black people for slavery in the US, and that say that white people are the ones who ended slavery?

I'm asking since you parrot Stormfront here too, not just Trump.
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Postby JMT on 22 Aug 2017 18:09

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

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Postby coach on 22 Aug 2017 20:29

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

JMT wrote:
coach wrote:So, just to be clear, the Robert E. Lee statue in Charlottesville was erected in 1924.
http://www.charlottesville.org/departme ... f-lee-park
NOBODY from the war was still alive at that time.


Of course they were. I agree with pretty much everything else you said, but that statement just isn't true.

Smithsonian Institute wrote:Thousands of Civil War veterans lived far into the 20th century. In 1913, 54,000 Union and Confederate veterans gathered at Gettysburg for the battle’s 50th anniversary, and an astonishing 2,000 were still alive to show up for the battle’s 75th anniversary in 1938. (Both events are represented in the library’s film and audio collections.) The last verified Union veteran died only in 1956, and the last Confederate in 1951. From the early 1900s through the 1940s, they were filmed, recorded and interviewed at reunions, parades and other patriotic events where, as the century advanced, they came increasingly to seem like ambulatory trophies from some distant age of heroes.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/c ... -97841665/

Damn! Those guys were some tough fucking bastards! And I guess I was too tired to do math right. And, for some reason, I keep thinking thinking that the Civil War ended in the 1850s.
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Postby coach on 22 Aug 2017 20:52

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

Another thing to remember is that people of color have been systemically discriminated against since the war (see also, white flight, suburbs). And, I don't mean systematically, I mean, systemically. I mean that the government on all levels, Federal, State, and Local, has had policies in place specifically designed to impoverish people of color and empower people of non-color. Not ALL governmental bodies, but bodies at all levels have done it. Both public (like universities) and private bodies have also systemically discriminated against people of color. Again, not ALL of them, but many to most of them.

Certainly, in recent years, maybe the last 40 or so, redresses and realignments have been started to actually live up to the ideal that all people are created equal. But for at least 100 years after the Civil War, discriminatory policies were commonplace.

And, those statues were one of those policies of discrimination. I remind you again that they were put up NOT to commemorate heroes, but rather to scare people of color. Seriously, the actual antithesis of what General Robert E. Lee wanted. They do not honor him, they disgrace him. They are disrespectful in the extreme. His clear wishes were that no Confederate monuments be erected.

As a matter of fact, I think there is good legal grounds to sue to have them taken down on the basis of incitement, as Tech mentioned earlier. I also think there is a reasonable case to be made that they are seditious and should be taken down for that reason, as well. Seriously, WHY are we celebrating traitors?

Again, this has nothing to do with history or hiding history. But, history belongs in a museum and in history books. Public statues should celebrate the best of our ideals as AMERICANS. Robert E. Lee certainly does not represent that. Furthermore, the conditions under which the statues were erected furthers the fact that they do not represent American ideals.

Remember, for every minute these statues stand, that is another minute that is LYING about our history. You want to talk about burying and rewriting history? That is EXACTLY what these statues do. So, if you are against rewriting history, if you are against burying history, then you should also be against having these statues continue to stand.

Keep it straight people.
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Postby pod on 22 Aug 2017 21:31

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

spool wrote:Hey Pod, did you vote for Trump? (I need yes or no answer, please)


No, but it I did, would you be firing up the death cab and coming round to take me out? I need a yes or no answer please.
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Postby JMT on 22 Aug 2017 22:15

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

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Postby pod on 22 Aug 2017 22:16

Re: Charlottesville, Virginia...

JMT wrote:Further down the rabbit hole we go...

ESPN pulls Asian-American announcer because his name is Robert Lee


There's also a comedian named Bobby Lee. Great guy actually.
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